RE: Why we don't like PHP /

php.internals

Hans Zaunere

21 years ago
> > That presents somewhat of a chicken-and-egg problem. Production
sites
> > won't be compelled to make a move until PHP recommends it in some
way,
> > or if there is a killer feature that pulls people in, regardless of
the
> > perceived stability. > > Right, and they shouldn't. If there is no compelling reason to
switch,
> why in the world should they? And why should we try to push them away > from a stable platform?
Agreed - there is no reason at this time.
> > Then perhaps some striking new functionality would push PHP 5/Apache
2.
> > While Apache 2 introduces new complexities, using some of the new > > features could be advantageous, and a step towards the next
generation.
> > For instance, allowing PHP to reach deeper into Apache, to a level > > similar to that of mod_perl, could provide significant new features
and
> > value. Getting PHP to control URL rewriting and logging, for
example,
> > could be new features that drive demands from end-developers, and at
the
> > same time generates interest and challenges for those developing PHP
and
> > Apache themselves. > > That has nothing to do with Apache2 and has been available for Apache1 > for years. It just isn't a very popular feature. See the
apache_hooks
> code.
I know apache_hooks but after discussion with George and others, I wouldn't feel comfortable recommending to clients, especially with EXPERIMENTAL notes and no mention on php.net. The potential functionality it could provide, however, would be very popular, on par with mod_rewrite. Whatever the particular feature is, my point is that the killer-solution or feature will drive going on to new things. Almost two years ago I ran PHP 4/Apache 2/threaded in production and it ran fine. Of course, the only extensions I used were MySQL and Oracle. However, I've since gone back to Apache 1, simply because there was no compelling reason to live on the edge. A chicken-and-egg problem, but perhaps it's time to think about incubating the egg. H

Rasmus Lerdorf

21 years ago
Hans Zaunere wrote:
> I know apache_hooks but after discussion with George and others, I > wouldn't feel comfortable recommending to clients, especially with > EXPERIMENTAL notes and no mention on php.net. The potential > functionality it could provide, however, would be very popular, on par > with mod_rewrite.
Again, that has nothing to do with Apache2. This same feature based on Apache2 isn't suddenly going to be non-experimental since the code would be mostly the same on the PHP side. How we actually hook it in would be slightly different.
> Whatever the particular feature is, my point is that the killer-solution > or feature will drive going on to new things.
Sure, but why Apache2? Apache2 is a brand new server. The next killer web server may just as easily be something completely different.
> Almost two years ago I ran PHP 4/Apache 2/threaded in production and it > ran fine. Of course, the only extensions I used were MySQL and Oracle. > However, I've since gone back to Apache 1, simply because there was no > compelling reason to live on the edge. A chicken-and-egg problem, but > perhaps it's time to think about incubating the egg.
But which egg? -Rasmus

George Schlossnagle

21 years ago
On Dec 30, 2004, at 2:23 PM, Hans Zaunere wrote:
>> >> That has nothing to do with Apache2 and has been available for Apache1 >> for years. It just isn't a very popular feature. See the >> apache_hooks >> code. > > I know apache_hooks but after discussion with George and others, I > wouldn't feel comfortable recommending to clients, especially with > EXPERIMENTAL notes and no mention on php.net. The potential > functionality it could provide, however, would be very popular, on par > with mod_rewrite.
It's probably non-functional. Getting it all functioning again is on my TODO, but is really really low due to the fact that like 5 people actually find it cool, and none of them actually planned on running it. George